"Apostrophe TV " in an interview with Metropolitan of Kyiv and All Ukraine, Primate of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine Epiphany, talked about the development of the OCU, the fight against external and internal enemies, about US President Donald Trump, about Russian dictator Vladimir Putin, and about how and when the war unleashed against Ukraine by Russia may end.
- It has been 6 years since the OCU received autocephaly. This was when the war was still going on in our country, but now we are living in the most difficult period of this war. Please tell me, is this war the same final test for our independence and for the faith of all Ukrainians.
- This war does not last three years or even 10, it lasts for several centuries. The enemy is the same. He tried to enslave us for centuries, to destroy us, but we were able to preserve our Ukrainian identity. They did everything they could to us: they dissolved us as a single Soviet people, they tried to destroy us with famines. But we survived, and for more than 30 years we have been building our common Ukrainian future in our independent state.
But, unfortunately, we are going through these trials now. As a church, we are going through trials with our Ukrainian people.
Now we see that 6 years ago there was a truly historic decision - granting the Ukrainian Church autocephaly, that is, independent status for its future existence, because this is truly another act of proclaiming our independence as a state.
This is very important, since the church plays a role in the formation of the state. In Ukraine, there is another church - the Russian one, which is trying to promote and help the enemy. Therefore, the OCU is being built up, gradually established. And I am convinced that soon all Orthodox Ukrainians will be part of our recognized local autocephalous church. We are working on this, it just takes time.
The war will certainly end in our victory, and we will restore, revive the country, because we have chosen a clear vector of our development as a European one. We are fighting for this and paying a very high price for it. Our best sons and daughters are giving the most precious thing – their lives – so that we can live in a single Ukrainian state and have our single local Ukrainian Orthodox Church.
- Vladyka, can you remember with what emotion you met the news that a full-scale war had begun?
- We were ready for this. The day before, national roundtables were held, where I had the floor, and they asked whether we would stand in the event of a full-scale invasion. I said clearly that we as a nation are spiritually strong, and the spirit always wins. I remember that the day before, our international partners also called me, they felt the danger, were worried and asked how long we would stand: a day, a week, a month, because the Russian army is much more numerous than ours. I replied that we are strong, invincible and will give an answer. I saw that some people smiled. But it happened as I said.
We Ukrainians know how to rally very quickly. We gave a rebuff that the enemy did not expect. We see that the strength of the spirit wins. Because even the most modern weapons in the hands of spiritually unspiritual people do not play a decisive role. We want a lasting and just peace, so that this war ends once and for all.
- And what did you feel when you saw Russian priests consecrating weapons, actually blessing the killing of Ukrainians? And is forgiveness of our enemy possible in the future?
- It was not a surprise to us, we talked about it. The Ukrainian Church has been fighting for over 30 years, and we understood these challenges. We talked about the danger of the existence of the Russian Orthodox Church in Ukraine, which is Putin's outpost in Ukraine. We have now severed all relations with the aggressor, but there remains one supposedly untouchable organization - the Russian Orthodox Church, which shouts to the whole world that there is supposedly persecution here. But everyone is equal before the law.
And we see that the Russian Church in Ukraine has joined the process of Putin's struggle against Ukraine. In the occupied territories, almost all the clergy supported the occupiers. And we see that in the fourth year of the war, many clergy are still being exposed who are helping the enemy. This shows that the Russian Church is an integral part of the Russian state, it is the Department of Religious Affairs, which openly helps Putin.
Before the full-scale invasion, they were still somehow masked, but now they are doing everything openly. This is done by the head of the Russian Orthodox Church, Kirill Gundyaev, who is a co-author of this destructive ideology of the “Russian world”. It was he who encouraged Putin to put this ideology into practice: that there is no Ukrainian state, there is no Ukrainian people. They have been instilling these narratives in Ukrainians for 30 years. This ideology has brought destruction, tears, pain and death to our peaceful home.
As for forgiving the enemy. We are Christians. But for our generation it is a difficult process. We see how children die every day. The question arises: what is the expediency of such things? The world has developed certain rules of warfare, which the Russian Federation does not take into account. They use weapons to kill peaceful people. Putin has a goal - to destroy the Ukrainian state, and he does not abandon it.
- Russia positions itself as an Orthodox state. Putin goes to churches, prays, kisses icons. But here a logical question arises: is there God in this country and does he hear the prayers of our enemies?
- Many representatives of other local Orthodox churches also ask themselves this question. Russia positions itself as a defender of traditional values. But we see something completely different. They bless war, and war is evil. They call war sacred.
Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew called this war a devilish war. Because war cannot be sacred. It brings evil. Soldiers are killed in it, and these are someone's sons, fathers, husbands. There is no family in Ukraine that would not be affected by this.
- How do the priests of the OCU relate to praying that our enemy may die as soon as possible?
- We have no right to wish evil. We should not accumulate resentment against evil, because it will destroy us from the inside. On the contrary, we must transform this hatred into something good and useful, so we call on Ukrainians to continue to unite to help, donate. This will contribute to the protection of our state.
In the words of Saint John Chrysostom, we should not accumulate this within ourselves, but on the contrary, as Christians, we should do everything to transform it into good and useful deeds that will change everything for the better.
- So you can't use bad words about Russians in prayer?
- We must leave everything to God's will. The Lord knows better than us. We pray that the Lord will reward them for their deeds.
- How did it happen that God allowed a war between two Orthodox peoples?
- We are people, we always want to find a reason somewhere. The Lord gave us freedom of choice. We choose between good and evil. We see that the Russian people have chosen a person who has directed this will against us, against the people who want to live in freedom. We know from the Holy Scriptures that wars also took place in those ancient times, when people forgot about God, considered themselves the creator on earth, and this leads to such negative consequences.
- In your opinion, has the number of people who are beginning to believe more increased or, on the contrary, become disillusioned when they see injustice and cruelty?
- There are different cases. But among the military, I have not heard a single answer that he is an unbeliever. On the front line, where death stares him in the eye, there are no unbelievers. Everyone asks for prayer. Who can help at this moment, if not God? We see many examples when a soldier was an atheist, and then became a believer. The Lord created a miracle. Many believers left the country. But the churches are filled again, that is, new people have come to replace them. Many people understand the need for faith in God.
- You often communicate with priests who are transferring to the OCU from the Moscow Patriarchate, but we see that some of the faithful remain pro-Russian. What keeps them there?
- Unfortunately, not many clergymen join the OCU. This ideology of the "Russian world" has penetrated very deeply into the minds of both clergymen and ordinary believers, who try to be faithful to the Moscow Patriarchate to the end. They have been forced into the idea that there is no salvation without Moscow. And this is surprising.
There are many clergy who say they are ready to leave the priesthood altogether, but do not join the OCU.
And people are gradually changing. We see how change is taking place in communities. But this takes time. We are building a church forever. Because without a strong, unified Ukrainian church, we will not build a strong European Ukraine. This is an axiom. But not everyone understands it. If we had had a unified Ukrainian church since the 90s, then, probably, this would not have happened now.
- Do you somehow support your faithful in the temporarily occupied territories?
- We support it. But it is becoming more and more difficult to do so. The clergy of our church are now, unfortunately, forced to leave the occupied territories. We urged them to do so for safety. Because there are cases where priests are killed there. The situation is not easy. The OCU is outside their law there. In the occupied territories, we cannot even act underground.
- There is a long-standing tradition that the OCU, together with the Vladyslav Molchanova Foundation, always donates thousands of Easter cakes to our defenders on Easter. Has the number of OCU benefactors increased and has the amount of aid transferred through the OCU to the front increased?
- There is indeed a tradition when on the eve of Easter we share our joy with the defenders, because our future fate depends on them. We have good benefactors, such as Vlada Molchanova. We implement many different projects with her. There are other benefactors, but the situation is difficult now. Everyone is already exhausted, and therefore we all join together to do good and useful things for the benefit of the state and our church.
- Why are there still representatives of the Moscow Patriarchate on the territory of the Kyiv Pechersk Lavra?
- This process is complicated. The spiritual de-occupation of the Lavra is taking place gradually. It was easier to do this with the upper Lavra, which belongs to the national reserve. The process is ongoing. The reserve and the Ministry of Culture are taking over the buildings, but until now, representatives of the Moscow Patriarchate are there. They are opposing it, they have support, including financial support, from pro-Russian forces. I am sure that gradually the Kyiv-Pechersk Lavra will belong to the true Ukrainian church.
- On March 30, the advisor and spiritual director of the US President, Pastor Mark Burns, arrived in Kyiv. Do you expect changes in religious policy towards Ukraine and the OCU, because the new Trump administration positions itself as protecting Christians around the world?
- I will not comment on the issue of religious leaders, because this is a Russian tradition. There is no such thing in the American tradition, and President Trump does not have a religious leader. But we have no violation of religious freedom. Any Republican administration over the past decades has mainly worked to maintain a balance of religious freedom in the world.
It is the Moscow Church that provides information that there is persecution and persecution in Ukraine. In reality, this is not the case. We have such freedom of religion in Ukraine that is not available in some European countries, even though we are in a state of war.
Therefore, we have no worries. We are not violating anything. Those clergymen of the Moscow Patriarchate who are currently under investigation are responsible for their actions as citizens. Everyone is equal before the law. This concerns the security of the Ukrainian state, and not freedom of religion. We are convinced that this freedom will continue to be preserved.
- In your opinion, when will the great war end and can there be any sign from God that we will survive this war?
- We have already survived. If you and I can gather here in the center of Kyiv, then we should thank God for that. The struggle continues. We have been opposing the enemy for over three years. This is truly a miracle. The Lord is helping and supporting us. We stopped the invasion of the Russian horde. I am convinced that the Lord will create the appropriate conditions. Because now the whole world, the best diplomats, and experts are modeling how the war in Ukraine will end. Everyone is interested in predicting, but it is very difficult.
Everyone was hoping for the arrival of President Trump, but it’s not that simple. I am sure that the Lord will create the conditions, and the enemy will voluntarily leave our land, as happened in Syria. I am convinced that something will happen in the Russian Federation, when they have no business with us, they will be forced to solve their internal affairs and they will leave our land.
One aggressor-tyrant cannot dictate his conditions to the whole world. Truth always wins. We know from history that there were periods when evil prevailed, but in the end truth, light and life always won. We must believe. And with unshakable faith, the Lord will help us in this.
- How many chaplains are there in the OCU and how do they choose this path?
- We spiritually support our Ukrainian army. There is a chaplaincy service. Now we have half a thousand chaplains. But we are gradually increasing the staff. There are many obstacles on this path. For example, a priest must become a military serviceman, take the oath and join the ranks. As I have already said, the military needs priests. Because a priest is a person they trust. He strengthens the spirit of the soldiers.
- What would you like to wish the readers and viewers of "Apostrophe" before the greatest Christian holiday - Easter?
- We are celebrating a truly great holiday, which should inspire us to continue the struggle. This holiday testifies that through the suffering that the Lord endured, there was a Resurrection. That is, through suffering we achieve victory. It was difficult, it will be difficult, but we will pass these trials with dignity and achieve what we strive for.
And we all strive for victory. We strive for a just peace to reign in Ukraine. But it all depends on each of us. We have no right to lose heart, but on the contrary, we must unite, support each other in difficult conditions, and inspire each other to continue the struggle.
If everyone in their place will do everything that depends on them, because the Lord will ask each of us: “Why didn’t you do it, having the appropriate opportunities?” Therefore, each of us must do everything that depends on him.
Sometimes, being alone, we think: well, what does it depend on me? But when we gather as a community, then together we are a great driving force that is able to overcome the obstacles that the aggressor country places on us. I wish that the Lord will strengthen us, inspire us, give us strength and health, to do everything in our power to bring our common great Ukrainian victory closer.
